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Politics abhors a vacuum. Without credible explanations for the things that bewilder and exasperate us, people become susceptible to extremist conspiracy theories, hate and lies. So how does truth survive? In her brand new book, “Doppelganger: A Trip into the Mirror World”, award-winning journalist Naomi Klein, (author of No Logo, The Shock Doctrine, et al), describes being confused with Naomi Wolf, author of The Beauty Myth, as Wolf morphed into a conspiracy-minded anti-vaxxer during the Covid pandemic. In an era of all important “personal brands”, Klein became absorbed in the deep fake, double worlds surrounding and sometimes coming to represent her online. Right-wing conspiracies feed off Left-wing silences, she concludes. In this far-ranging interview from her home in British Columbia, Canada, Klein describes listening to hours and hours of conspiracist Steve Bannon’s podcasts, and researching doppelgangers in history and literature, in order to uncover why we have shadow selves, and how disinformation and conspiracy theories gain power. Join Laura Flanders for this charming conversation as Naomi Klein challenges us to overcome divide-and-conquer individualism if we are ever to tackle our real-life, systemic crises. And Laura shares a few thoughts on learning from our elders about the pre-digital age.
“ the pressure we’re putting on the self . . . is part of why we’re seeing so many people crack. I don’t think the self can support the amount that we are putting on it: It’s our income. It’s our retirement. It’s our safety. It’s our lifeboat . . . And it’s an illusion because we cannot protect ourselves from the forces that we’re up against . . . Our only hope of protection is through collective work and collective movement building.” – Naomi Klein
“Very often we think that the solution is deplatforming . . . What I’ve seen is that it’s actually kind of supercharged the movement. People wear it as a badge of honor . . . I am less interested in how we control speech and much more interested in how we drain conspiracy culture of its energy, of its power.” – Naomi Klein
- Naomi Klein: Journalist & Best-Selling Author, Doppelganger: A Trip into the Mirror World, The Shock Doctrine, No Logo, This Changes Everything & On Fire
Show Notes: Related Episodes, Articles and More
- “Doppelganger: A Trip Into the Mirror World” by Naomi Klein. Learn more here.
(*Bookshop is an online bookstore with a mission to financially support local, independent bookstores. The LF Show is an affiliate of bookshop.org and will receive a small commission if you click through and make a purchase.)
Related Laura Flanders Show Episodes:
- Johann Hari: Get Your Mind Back / Save Democracy? Watch / Download Podcast
- Naomi Klein on the Case for a Green New Deal Watch / Download Podcast
- AOC & Noam Chomsky: The Way Forward Watch / Download Podcast
Related Articles and Resources:
- AI machines aren’t ‘hallucinating’. But their makers are, by Naomi Klein, The Guardian – Read Here
- Naomi Klein Sees Uncanny Doubles in Our Politics, by Jia Tolentino, The New Yorker – Read Here
- Naomi Klein on Conspiracy Culture and “The Mirror World”, The Intercept: Deconstructed Podcast Read Here / Listen
Featured ‘Music in the Middle’ of the Podcast:
- “Connections” featuring lyrics by Reg E. Gaines and music by Calvin Gaines, courtesy of the artists. Learn More Here
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